Former Treasury Secretary Larry Summers grew irritated and erupted in anger during a podcast debate with a Trump administration official who blamed him for the nation’s trade imbalance with China.
David Sacks, the newly appointed “crypto czar” in President Donald Trump’s administration, engaged in a heated confrontation with Summers during a tense exchange on the “All In” podcast on Sunday.
The fiery back-and-forth spotlighted ongoing divisions over trade policy, globalization and the long-term economic impact of US-China relations.
Sacks, a venture capitalist and vocal libertarian, used his appearance on the podcast to criticize decades of US policy he claims hollowed out American manufacturing — specifically blaming Summers for supporting China’s entry into the World Trade Organization (WTO) during the Clinton administration.
“The millions of Americans who lost their jobs in the heartlands because we let China into the [World Trade Organization], which is something that Larry supported, that’s what started this whole thing,” Sacks said, referring to the wave of industrial decline that followed China’s 2001 admission into the global trade body.
Summers, who served as treasury secretary under President Bill Clinton and has long defended globalization as a force for economic growth, quickly pushed back.
“Respectfully, you’re talking nonsense,” he responded.
The clash escalated quickly as Sacks fired back: “What are you talking about, Larry? You were Treasury Secretary when we walked China into the WTO, and you’re still defending it!”
Summers, who has harshly criticized President Trump’s tariff policies, attempted to interject repeatedly, but Sacks, visibly frustrated, lashed out at the format of the discussion.
“Wait, wait, wait. Why am I the only one who gets to talk for two seconds before I get interrupted?” he said.
“You guys get five-to-ten minute speeches! Is that the way this works? I get to speak for two seconds, then you interrupt me, [and] you speak for five or ten minutes!”
Once he regained the floor, Sacks continued laying the blame squarely on Summers’ shoulders, tying the decision to support China’s WTO membership to the long-term erosion of US industrial power.
“That’s where the hemorrhaging of millions of industrial jobs began,” he said.
Summers responded by asking Sacks if he could name “a single trade barrier that was reduced by the United States associated with China accession” to the WTO.
“Can you name any restriction on Chinese exports to the United States that was in effect in 1999 [before China’s entry into the WTO] and was removed by our WTO accession in 2000?” Summers asked Sacks.
The former treasury secretary added that China gained most favored nation status in 1980 — when the Carter administration was in power.
Most favored nation (MFN) status, which is usually a prerequisite for joining the WTO, ensures that a country receives the same favorable trade terms — such as the lowest tariffs and fewest barriers — that a nation offers to any other trading partner.
Sacks’ appointment as White House lead on digital currencies and artificial intelligence has raised eyebrows in Washington in light of his past support for Democrats including Hillary Clinton and Gavin Newsom.
Sacks, a former executive at PayPal, is considered one of the driving forces behind Silicon Valley’s ongoing rightward political shift — bringing with him a cohort of venture capitalists who have grown increasingly critical of the Biden administration’s regulatory approach to crypto and AI.
Sacks is said to have played a pivotal role in lobbying for fellow venture capitalist and Sen. JD Vance (R-Ohio) to be chosen as Trump’s 2024 running mate.
Sacks has praised the president’s willingness to “move at tech speed” on issues like deregulation and he has repeatedly applauded Trump’s dismantling of what he calls the “Biden-era war on crypto.”
